Thursday, May 23, 2013

Where I Come In: An open letter in defense of Dr. Erik Thoennes


Some Background: In recent weeks, Dr. Erik Thoennes, Chair of Biblical and Theological Studies at Biola University, has come under fire from a number of groups alleging that his remarks regarding a biblical view of homosexuality were inflammatory, insensitive, bigoted, and most importantly, unchristlike. The Huffington Post published this piece by Rev. Dr. Cindi Love about the Biola Queer Underground, a group of undergraduate students who recently announced their sexual orientation on a conservative evangelical Christian campus that denounces homosexuality. In her support of these students and her rejection of perspectives that adhere to a traditional biblical view of human sexuality, Dr. Love calls out Dr. Thoennes for his refusal to embrace homosexuality as an acceptable lifestyle for a committed believer.


Where I Come In:
An open letter in defense of Dr. Erik Thoennes
by Zach Underwood

I don’t have time to be writing this letter. I don’t have the energy. I don’t have the emotional wherewithal. I don’t have the spotless background to condemn sexual sin in others without hypocrisy, and to do so would be to invite having my nose rubbed in my own impurity. My life has at times been rife with sexual sin: the allure of fornication, the ubiquitousness of adultery, the temptation of pornography. Despite decades of being a Christian, there are still things in this world that can leave your purity in a heap of rubble. I am no different (forget ‘better’) than the adulterer who ruins a marriage or embraces the idol of sexual gratification, or the base, lust-filled fornicator who lives in the flesh instead of in the spirit. In fact, I am he. By aligning myself with Dr. Thoennes here today, I don't doubt that the little pink equal signs that riddle my facebook home page will in all likelihood begin to slowly dwindle as some 'unfriend' me for admitting to the reality of sin in my past, and others, for coming out of the closet as a "closed-minded bigot". For more reasons than I can possibly count, it is neither personally profitable nor professionally beneficial for me to stand shoulder to shoulder with K. Erik Thoennes, a man whose treatment by other people in the recent days has left me puzzled and dismayed. And while many people, Christian or otherwise, may disagree with me, the tide has shifted in this country to the point that the reprisal I may face for remarks in his defense could isolate and marginalize me in a way that a GLBTQ individual could never possibly understand. I do it gladly all the same, without apology and without concern for how these words may affect my worth in the eyes of men.
For starters, I’d like to point out that it takes courage, grit, and good ol’ fashion guts for a GLBTQ student at Biola University or any other conservative Christian campus to come out of the closet publicly. I believe (and trust that Dr. Thoennes would concur) that a loving, living, and sovereign God loves those students more than this flimsy letter could ever presume to express. I pray with all my heart that the fifteen students of the Biola Queer Underground, and all those who have not yet made the decision to declare their sexuality publicly, know that as well. It breaks my heart when homosexuals or anyone else have to endure bullying or abuse for any reason, including abuse resulting from the way they choose to publicly identify themselves. Courage, however, while virtuous, is not exclusively employed in acts of righteousness. We musn't forget that the fortitude to speak openly about something so sensitive under such difficult circumstances, is not what makes them right or wrong. Likewise, the boldness with which Dr. Thoennes compared 'queerness' to 'racism', does not make him right or wrong.
I’d also like to add that while I don’t believe Dr. Thoennes has ever bullied or berated a person for their sexual orientation (nor was this audio clip of his dispassionate remarks necessarily deserving of the label ‘homophobic rant’), I do admit that comparing queerness to racism is an argument fraught with potentially perilous misunderstandings, both with and without proper context. The only mistake I'll concede that Dr. Thoennes actually made was assuming that everyone who heard his comments was starting from the same baseline as he was with the same presuppositions of biblical truth. If we assume one accepts that the bible declares homosexuality to be sin, comparing the two is not only logical inasmuch as Dr. Thoennes believes that both homosexuality and racism are sins, but is also a brilliant rhetorical maneuver. He takes the oft-touted civil rights angle in defense of homosexuality (that being part of an ethnic minority and being part of a sexual minority, are identically innate and therefore justifiable) and turns it on its ear. Rather than compare being marginalized for reasons of race to being marginalized for reasons of sexual proclivity, he draws a clear line in the sand between intolerance of a person’s God-given nature and intolerance of someone’s sin, and exposes the logical flaw inherent in the arguments of those who attempt a biblical defense of homosexuality, namely, the faulty assumption that one thing (racism) is a sin and the other (homosexuality) is not. Please do not misunderstand me: the assumption, “homosexuality is not a sin” is faulty, not necessarily the belief “that homosexuality is not a sin”. To prove the belief is faulty, one must decide whose authority it will appeal to on the subject. As sad as I find it that in our culture, someone in my position would find that the burden of proof falls to him, I accept that challenge with a glad heart. Frankly, as a wretched man in a fallen world, I would normally err on the side that it is incumbent upon me (as the one who is embracing potentially sinful behavior) to prove that my sin is either justifiable, unavoidable, or in fact, not sin at all. As scripture is quite clear on sin, I have never successfully accomplished this. Instead, as the author of a letter defending a wicked, wretched sinner by his own admission, like Dr. Erik Thoennes, and at the risk of losing whatever readers have decided to graciously bear with me thus far, I gladly accept the mantle of presenting the biblical view of homosexuality.
The biblical perspective of homosexuality is that it is a sin, whether we like it or not, that is no different from any other sin. Genesis 19 says that the men in Sodom and Gomorrah were punished for their sexual perversion, not simply their violent desire to rape Lot’s guests. Leviticus identifies homosexuality as an abomination, twice (18:22 and 20:13). Jude 7 identifies homosexuality as a sinful, unnatural desire that must be punished. Romans 1:26-27 is very specific in regards to the seriousness of homosexuality. All that said, homosexuality is neither more than nor less than, a sin. The church may be full of wrongheaded people who see being gay as a real sin (a ‘serious’ one as opposed to those little white sins—‘innocuous’ little things like gossip or slander) but a proper view of sin, is that in the eyes of the Lord, all sin is equally inhibiting to the communion between the created and their Creator. I have asked people who both condemn homosexuality outright and who defend it blindly if it is more wrong for a pastor’s wife to gossip until the day she dies without recognition or repentance, or for a homosexual to deny the sinfulness of their thoughts/actions and their need for repentance from sexual impurity that he or she fails to recognize. It’s not an easy question to answer, but the short version is that all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. The nature of that sin is less important than the reality, persistence, and ultimate effect of that sin; it is a deficiency that renders us ineligible for worshiping at the feet of a holy and just God.
The rotten truth of the matter is that I am probably guilty of more heterosexual sin than many homosexuals are of homosexual sin (which hopefully you realize must exist, even if you've decided homosexuality isn't inherently wrong—there is plenty of heterosexual sin on this earth), and if there was some sort of variable tipping scale with which to weigh my sin against the standard of righteousness that is God’s holiness, I would likely be more guilty and worthy of condemnation than most practicing homosexuals. The beauty of the Gospel is that it doesn’t work that way at all. Aside from necessitating our destruction in the absence of a savior, our sinfulness predates our existence and is confirmed by almost every impulsive thought or massive failure we have ever found scribbled on our ledger. A biblical perspective of sin however, says that sin is sin, and that any wickedness, be it great or small, is enough to separate us from the love of God. I’d venture to guess that all GLBTQ individuals sinned well before those desires kicked in, let alone before they acted on them. So this means that any single sin is enough to drive a wedge between us and a sovereign God, regardless of whether or not that sin is sexual in nature.  
But this means that Christians who embrace alternative sexual orientations have a problem on their hands. If the recognize that all have sinned, and everyone needs a savior, then in regards to homosexuality they must either reject the veracity of scripture, or deny its importance in comparison to the demands of a modern and increasingly tolerant society. The Bible, as the divinely-inspired Word of God states repeatedly that homosexuality is a sin. The intellectually honest believer could better start by denying the infallibility of scripture than simply reinterpreting the bible to suit their whims. The truth of the matter is however, that our feelings, our desires, our emotions, our vitriol, and even our faith, are insufficient for reconciling us to God. They’re equally insufficient for justifying a rewriting of the Gospel that embraces a particular lifestyle.

That “it doesn’t work that way” is one of the most beautiful realities of the Gospel.
The problem is that many people who claim to embrace the teachings of Christ, tend not to actually care that Christ died (and rose again) for the very real, very serious, very evil sins of the world, atoning in an instant for every deficiency of those who call upon his name as their only hope for salvation. We don’t even have to start with whether or not homosexuality qualifies as sin—we’re afforded an opportunity to look first at whether or not we all qualify as sinners, as the New Testament (which I keep seeing bandied about as a defense of queerness) clearly states. If we start with that, the question of whether or not homosexuality is acceptable for a believer to practice, while an astonishingly important one, is completely marginalized by the enduring work of Jesus of Nazareth on the cross. In other words, even if your homosexuality, or my sexual sin, or Dr. Thoennes’ is completely natural and acceptable (through some misunderstanding of scripture) then we all still need a Savior! Homosexuals are not condemned simply because of the alleged biggest sins in their lives—regardless of whether or not we agree that it’s a sin—but the aggregate of sin in their lives, which constitutes a sinful nature from which no naturally born human being in the history of man is exempt.

To those who would argue that Christ was tolerant and accepting of all people, I take umbrage. He loved all people, yes. But love requires truth, and it necessitates a desire to see truth reign supreme and falsehood scattered to the ends of the earth. The underlying assumption of Jesus Christ during his ministry may in fact have been a headstrong, self-assured, confidence. “Whaddya got? Name the sin in which you are drowning—I’ll take on all comers! There is no sin too big for me.” Jesus likely knew very well that there was no sin lurking in the hearts of man that could escape extinction from Calvary’s ruthless assault on darkness. But he didn’t hang out with prostitutes, enjoy a light dinner and some casual conversation, and then bid them a good evening with a hearty and tolerant, “Keep up the good work, ladies!” Instead, he called sinners to repentance. He told people to take up their cross and follow him, to hate their father and mother, to sell everything they had and give to the poor, to “repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” The silly version of Jesus that so many people ‘believe in’—the hyper-deferential, Zen Buddhist, goody-two-shoes, kumbaya-preaching Jesus that gets constantly waved in my face—never actually makes an appearance in my Bible.
Sadly, what many people are unable to glean from the abundance of scathing criticisms of Dr. Thoennes, is that he believes that he is called to preach the gospel of Christ—not to simply speak academically about it. He and the majority of his colleagues have no interest in being popular, hip, liked, or ‘seeker friendly’ if it’s to come at the cost of seeing biblical truth undermined. As a pastor, Dr. Thoennes may want to see butts in the seats on Sunday, but he has made a conscious decision not to water down Scripture in order to put them there. And despite whatever privilege people may confer upon the middle-aged, white males who constitute much of the faculty at Biola, it was actually this same specific demographic that Dr. Thoennes points to for perpetuating atheism—a belief which has undermined the role of moral absolutes, the existence of definitive truth in society, and is largely responsible for the proliferation of uneducated and misguided interpretations of Scripture. Ironically, many of the recent remarks made as an indictment of Dr. Thoennes and people of his ilk, quote New Testament authors like Paul and Peter in defense of their beliefs, not only playing lingual gymnastics with their words (like citing passages which are clearly meant to bridge divisions between Jews and Gentiles), but are often just a stone’s throw away from passages where those divinely-inspired authors admonish their audiences not to contort Scripture to fit their whims and sinful desires. Unfortunately, this rather tragic irony is lost on those who have already decided that they—and not the millennia of foolhardy and misguided Christians who constitute the Body of Christ—are the only ones in history to correctly interpret biblical doctrine in regards to homosexuality. An intellectually honest proponent of a biblical defense of homosexuality would be better served to start by assuming they are trying to contort scripture to suit their sinful desires, rather than assume that the titans upon whose shoulders they stand were too ignorant and pigheaded to properly glean biblical truth from biblical texts.
It is hard, to be sure, for some Christians to consider the possibility that scripture makes no defense of homosexuality. Presupposing for a moment, that everything you believe is wrong, is a remarkably healthy, remarkably difficult thing to do. But dismissing an idea as ‘archaic’ has almost nothing to do with that idea’s veracity or merit, and instead has everything to do with what a modern society has decided is the proper perspective of that idea. To put it another way, it takes an ideological shift in the authority one recognizes and subscribes to in order to justify rejecting scriptural truth and instead embracing society’s truth. It’s a decision every one of us must make, but instead far too many people skip that step, presuming instead to realign scripture to their desires, rather than conforming their hearts to the Word of God. I know this, because I make this same mistake almost every day of my life.
Finally, many people listening to statements from other people regarding Dr. Thoennes, or even his own remarks, may conclude that he is a misguided and calloused man who unapologetically made indefensible statements regarding people who identify themselves as 'queer'. Others may conclude that he isn’t totally ignorant but simply made a mistake, an error in judgment that led to unfortunate phrasing. It would be easy for me, in my defense of Dr. Thoennes, to portray him as thoughtless, illogical, or insensitive, in my haste to spare him from words like ‘bigoted’, ‘bullying’ and ‘brutish’. Unfortunately, I can’t do any of that. The man I know is among the most, sensitive, kind, compassionate and thoughtful men I’ve ever met. Furthermore, any assumptions that he sees the sin of a homosexual as being worse than his own are completely unfounded. Dr. Thoennes would never suggest that his own wickedness is somehow less toxic than a homosexual’s. But to the Christian who reads this, whether they have or have not made up their mind about what God’s Word says about this issue, Dr. Thoennes’ attention to scriptural truth over the acceptance of society and the banal platitudes of people whose ‘god’ doesn’t even fit in the box they put him in, tells me all I need to know. Bear in mind, my opinion of his character has literally nothing to do with whether or not he is right. But Dr. Thoennes, if he is in fact speaking biblical truth, is oozing love for all of those around him, regardless of their sexual orientation. And it doesn’t take more than a cursory examination of Scripture to see that he is in lockstep with it. But ostracizing and marginalizing homosexuals is the opposite of what Dr. Thoennes stands for, because he doesn’t pray for the GLBTQ community to cast off their identity and embrace Christ’s—he prays for everyone to cast off their identity and embrace Christ’s. And whether his perspective resonates with you or not, Erik Thoennes isn’t concerned with seeing 'queers' come to Jesus—he’s concerned with seeing sinners come to Jesus.
And that’s where I come in…


11 And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers,12 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, 13 until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ, 14 so that we may no longer be children, tossed to and fro by the waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by human cunning, by craftiness in deceitful schemes. 15 Rather, speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in every way into him who is the head, into Christ, 16 from whom the whole body, joined and held together by every joint with which it is equipped, when each part is working properly, makes the body grow so that it builds itself up in love.                    --Chapter 4 of Paul’s letter to the Ephesians

12 comments:

  1. Zach -- I love this sentence:

    The silly version of Jesus that so many people ‘believe in’—the hyper-deferential, Zen Buddhist, goody-two-shoes, kumbaya-preaching Jesus that gets constantly waved in my face—never actually makes an appearance in my Bible.

    Clarity of thought and reasoning makes for such compelling writing. What a pleasure and a joy to read. I could go on, but I'll keep it short. Thank you.

    A brother in Christ (and other ways),

    Karl Thoennes

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  2. Hi,

    A few questions. What is this an open letter in response to exactly? I initially took it to be in response to my open letter but I see no direct reference to any of the content of my letter nor asking for anything openly concrete. Nowhere in my open letter does the question of whether or not homosexuality, and much more broadly LGBTQ identities, is sinful. That's a discussion that may sit alongside questions of oppression but needn't be 'at bottom' or anything. You can believe everything you listed in this letter and still ask the question why queer people are being singled out, policed, and oppressed on Biola's campus.

    I don't doubt Thoennes is a deeply kind man to the people he loves and is kind too. I also don't doubt that some of those people are queer. This is absolutely irrelevant to the content of my letter though, which addresses how *his words* (which are not his intent or thoughts about his words, are not his past actions or current actions regarding other queer people, are not his love for non-queer students, etc) bully queer students, particularly queer students of color. It's a question of power, privilege, and systemic violence, not of sin, moral subjects, or politeness. I feel I spelled this out in my letter pretty clearly. People very 'morally' and politely oppress people everyday.

    I have no problem with people telling themselves that identifying as within the LGBTQ umbrella is sinful. What you tell yourself is your business as far as I'm concerned. What I have a problem with is once those ideas manifest themselves as material violence. Not addressing that violence, making a joke about it, treating it as absurd, and so on is to participate in that very violence. I don't want to rehash all my arguments here as I'm sure you've read my letter. If you'd like to discuss the content of my letter I am totally willing to. If you'd like to discuss things outside of it though, i.e. whether or not homosexuality is a sin, I'm not very interested in that. It's not in my letter and it's not what I'm talking about.

    Sincerely,

    Jos

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    1. Hi Jos,

      Thanks for your thoughtful reply. I'm sorry for the very evident confusion caused by not only posting on GQU but also using the same 'open letter' phrasing/template as you had. Honestly, I put it on Huffington because I was having a hard time with Rev. Dr. Love's characterization of Dr. Thoennes, your characterization of his remarks, and the modest war being waged by GLAAD. Of course we would both agree that the freedom to think, feel and speak the way you want to is a right that you and Dr. Thoennes share equally. Without it, none of this would be the actual issue. I apologize for directing most of my remarks toward Dr. Love. That length lends itself to an occasional lack of clarity.

      I have two questions in response to your charges of Dr. Thoennes, bearing in mind I only saw the clip you posted of his remarks, and have gotten most of my information from the handful of people condemning them. In multiple conversations with Dr. Thoennes since that forum, he has never mentioned it. My first question is to your charges of violence: I have admittedly been absent in recent years on Biola's campus, but spent thousands of hours on campus during the years leading up to your graduation. This is the first I have ever heard of violence toward anyone save for a couple break-ins, 'queer' or otherwise. Since you have more experience and knowledge of it, I defer to you.

      As to the institutionalization of oppression, I don't doubt that a school which views a fundamental element of your identity as sinful must surely create an environment that reeks of oppression. My question is, in light of the fact that the school has very clearly held views on this matter, what do you want them to do if not acquiesce? You've stated repeatedly that you don't want to 'debate'/discuss whether or not homosexuality is a sin. Believe me, I couldn't agree with you more. It's not that I don't respect the opinions of others, but I know how you feel--at some point, why are we even bothering to try and make our case for the things we believe when they're so diametrically opposed to one another? It's exhausting to you I don't doubt, and I sincerely respect your wish to table indefinitely any discussion of that issue. However, in light of what the school believes, and the fact that that issue is at the core of the policies and protocols that you wish to see changed, what do you propose is the next step? I would love to hear from you on all of this and forgive me for tossing around so many questions, but in the meantime I'd like to (rather presumptuously) take a guess as to your response. I think what you want to see is institutional change from what you have alleged is an openly hostile environment toward people who are violating school policy (expulsion is a hostile thing, in my opinion, but it's the school's right) to an environment in which people of all walks of life (and sexual preferences) can coexist and enjoy the wonderful benefits and community of your alma mater. And perhaps, racism was not the best example. Maybe the degradation of chastity which has become so rampant at Christian colleges nationwide, might have been a better point of comparison than something so universally accepted as evil. In other words, no one says to those condemning racism, "Geez, just lighten up..." whereas one might very well say that about . On one hand, I recognize 'basic human decency' as the virtue to which you are appealing.

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    2. On the other hand, your desire to see change at the school seems predicated on appealing to the virtue of modernity and more cosmopolitan perspectives of morality, sexuality, etc. Places like Biola literally exist to stem the tide of modernity, and to weed out the degradation of values that have sustained generations throughout and before the history of this country, and to promote the values and advances that will make tomorrow brighter. Make no mistake, I think that bullying and hatred should always be weeded out and discarded, and Lord willing, one day eradicated. But in the absence of evidence as to the extreme prejudice used in the policing and afflicting of queer students, I'm afraid I really don't know what you want. For the campus police to 'lighten up'? For teachers to replace slurs which I have never heard or seen, with something more tolerant? Even if that sort of behavior is tolerated or perhaps even institutionalized--which in my opinion ought to have been addressed the VERY FIRST TIME it reared its ugly head--to what extent ought Biola go about violating some fairly fundamental principles in the name of accommodating people whose lifestyle is directly at odds with its values? They would never tolerate affairs between professors, and they tip toe as admirably as one can through the minefield of impropriety and allegations of improper behavior behind closed doors, without sacrificing the principles upon which their policies are based for the actions they take. Despite disagreeing with the school's stance, shouldn't you be proud of a place like Biola for sticking up for what it believes to be true, and holy and good in a culture where the tide is winning and people shout them down and scream for resignations for doing so? I cannot imagine how difficult it would be to go through college in the closet--honestly, you're a stronger soul than I am. I hate the idea that you or anyone in a similar situation should have to live in fear of reprisal for something so fundamental to your identity. But if the consensus on campus regarding the acceptability of alternative sexualities is so clear, what do you want them to do? I know that counseling and similar measures are insulting and often infuriating to GLBTQ students. Frankly, I don't blame them for feeling that way. But why, if the school believes it to be a sin, should they relent on this issue and not on any other matter regarding expressions of human sexuality outside the context of a marriage, like adultery, fornication, etc.? It's so sad that this is an issue, not only because of how despicable hatred is, but also (in my view) for how warped and impotent the word 'tolerance' has become. Why is it that my hopefully gentle response to Dr. Love's article can so easily be dismissed as hatespeech or bigotry (no one has said that yet, for the record). Why were Dr. Thoennes' remarks branded shamefully racist, when he appeals to the universally accepted notion that racism is evil? Even when asked about why no one on the panel was pro-GLBTQ, his response was even, measured, logical and clear: "Because we believe it's a sin." Do you at least see his point that it would be absurd to hold a forum about racism and bring in the other side to the debate? I know you don't equate the two, but the only parallel Biola or Dr. Thoennes has drawn between the two is that neither one is a biblically defensible way to live your life (and one of them, racism, isn't even logically or rationally defensible). That's it.

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    3. Thoennes and others at Biola believe full well that as Americans and as Human Beings you and others have a right to live the way you want to--but the original caveat to the American Dream and every generation who worked and fought before our silly "Believe in yourself" generation is that you are responsible for the consequences that result from your actions. Apparently, at Biola, this involves administrative discipline, or the unenviable task campus security has of asking all couples (gay or straight) to break it up. I think we write off the consequences because we spend our entire lives now hearing from all sides that we don't have to be responsible to and for those consequences. It's a lie, Jos.

      Honestly, I was thinking before I read the HuffPost article just how little racism offends me anymore. It's dumb of me to be sure, when I've never been victimized that badly for my race, but it's even difficult for me to realize how someone who has frequently dealt with that type of oppression could care one lick what someone so depraved and so ignorant and so evil thinks of them... I recognize that A) you feel the same way about BLGTQ (I really have to stop and think before I type that--takes me at least five seconds every time) discrimination and oppression and B) you may even see me to some extent to be no different when it comes to those matters. Of course it's a sensitive topic and I don't know the first thing about the abuse people have suffered over race or homosexuality--my sentiment itself is almost indefensible. But I just can't help but feel pity for people who are so narrow-minded as to discriminate or abuse based on DNA. Geography at least, as opposed to skin color, is a controllable thing. And it's totally okay and understandable if you feel that pity on me--really. I know that we just don't see eye to eye on it. But that brings me to my last point. We could. We could see eye to eye on that but it would take me imagining the 'unlikely' scenario in which I, Zach Underwood, and not you, Jos Charles, am wrong. Likewise, it would take you doing the same (or opposite, or whatever, since you probably don't have trouble imagining me being wrong). I think where I get lost on our 'agree to disagree' moment is where I appeal to scripture (forget just for a moment the thousands of years of tradition, discomfort with things we don't understand, sanctioned oppression, abuses of power and inexcusable actions taken against millions of people) and you seem to appeal to your feelings. I don't trust mine, Jos, even when I'm tempted for a moment to just excuse sin in my life, or in the lives of those around me. EVEN when I'm tempted to feel or even say, we need to drop this debate... let's not make a federal case out of it (that's coming whether we like it or not). And you can't know this, and it won't much change things, but I have been an adamant supporter of alternative sexuality being just a plain ol' sin, rather than the mega-sin designation nearly every conservative evangelical group seems to confer upon it. The church does itself a disservice by isolating and ostracizing people because they can't view something so foreign to them as just a sin no different from their own. I, and many others, are still working on that.

      Finally, while I would be blessed and excited to discuss theology and your perspective of Christianity, walk with God, etc. I would never presume to pry into subjects so intimate and personal. But I'll leave you with this: Like good faith, good policy comes from good doctrine and good doctrine comes from good understanding of scripture, and understanding comes from the Holy Spirit. Aside from that, you and I can both agree that we are sinners one way or the other. There's our middle ground.

      Apologies (and you're a trooper for bearing with me),

      Zach

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    4. PS - Really, it's very good of you to dignify my letter with a response. I'm grateful for all thoughtful people. I am truly sorry if you see this note or even me as a 'polite oppressor'. Whether I mean any oppression (which I do not) is of course totally irrelevant. I hope you don't mistake this for pigheadedness or heavy-handed sanctimony. The Lord bless you and keep you.

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    5. Goodness, I should proof:

      1. I don't mean queer breakins, I just remembered that there had been some mild 'violence' that my budding intellectual honesty could not omit in good conscience.
      2. "...whereas one might very well say that ["Geez, just lighten up..."] about *.
      * this should have ended in: premarital sex, cohabitation, etc.
      3. I literally made my snarky comment about how hard it is to keep that acronym straight (not a pun) and then GOT IT WRONG! That wasn't intentional and I am so sorry, really.

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  3. Jos, I'll respond more thoroughly in a moment. Forgive me--the initial draft actually referenced Rev. Dr. Cindi Love's article on HuffPost. Most of the traffic to this letter has come from Huffington, and I mentioned her at the top. With her multiple titles I found the heading getting a bit long, so I cut it out. I didn't mean to insinuate otherwise by putting it up on your site. (PS--haven't read past the first line or two of your comment. about to)

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  4. I would like to see on campus what I made a call for in my letter. I think, at the very least, queer students on campus aren't going to be heard until they're given a platform by which to be heard.

    Really, when it comes down to it, I'm asking Biola to actually just enforce policy that is nominally in place--to treat all students fairly. Whether or not queer students should be allowed to be in sexual relationship etc seems like a question of whether or not we, the student body, think pre-marital sex is or isn't at conflict with our religious beliefs. That seems like a whole, entire other discussion that needn't be centered around queer sexuality but sexuality in general. Nowhere have I asked that queer students should be able to be exempt from contract or anything. That's just something entirely else.

    I want to see a Biola where queer students can show just as much affection, present as the gender they identify as, and so on, as much as cis straight students. That simply will not happen as long as at forums our voice is not represented. What is so heinous about Thoennes statements is partially contextual--in that there was no LGBTQ-affirming Christian to offer a different perspective. I would like to see a Biola where that can happen--where we don't have to have open letters and Huffington Post articles, but simple dialogue on campus.

    We simply aren't there yet. Thoennes refuses to return any of my attempts to get a hold of him. So, I will make sure someone listens to me then, because the climate on campus towards queer students is nothing shy of hostile. My examples in the letter are all things I've witnessed. Queer students are second-class on campus--unable to use the correct gendered facilities, unable to show affection, demeaned publicly, mocked by students and faculty, and so on.

    So yes we are very emotionally invested. We are very hurt and very serious. I think it's very understandable when you imagine where we are coming from.

    Thanks for your response,

    Jos






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    1. Hey Jos,

      I'll be brief (compared to the other two). First, as a private institution, Biola is and hopefully always will be a school that seeks to be a light to the world. I don't expect many people (alums, trustees, admins, board members, etc.) would think much of the idea that the student body ought to dictate policy at a private Christian school. I, and probably the people I mentioned up there, honestly couldn't care less if a group of students were debating whether or not pre-marital sex was at odds with their religious beliefs, but I would be quite grateful that in the midst of their search for answers, that the decision was not left to those students. As for the oppression you face, I believe slurs and bullying should be no more tolerated on campus than any other sin—we just differ on what qualifies as sin, oppression, and apparently violence.

      Second, you said that you just want your voice to be heard, and I think we could honestly agree that it is being heard (by HP, CBS, etc.) But you are coming at this with a seeming disregard for the debate at the heart of this issue: whether or not a lifestyle of alternative sexuality is acceptable for a bible-believing Christian (who attends Biola—anywhere else, and that last qualifier is irrelevant. In America, you can be, feel, think speak and act however you please). But by disregarding the core of the debate, you seem to be essentially waiving your right to be heard in the forum of a Bible college. I agree that declining to invite the opposition can often look bad, but for a school originally known as the Bible Institute of Los Angeles, I kind of see why this may appear to be a more cut and dry issue for people like the Biblical and Theological Studies Chair. By forgoing the part of the dialogue you say you're seeking where we seek out the biblical perspective of a particular topic, not to mention denouncing the perspective held by the governing body, you seem to be overplaying your cards to a certain extent. On one hand, you don't want to get into a 'debate' as to whether or not homosexuality is sinful. On the other, you want your 'voice to be heard’ on a panel meant to address that very point. So in a sense, you're disqualifying yourself with that stance, while Dr. Thoennes is more qualified to speak than most for a number of reasons (he's a Ph.D on staff, he's a department chair, he was invited to speak, he's more than happy to discuss the topic of homosexuality according to the bible) and you prefer to skip the part where you explain why you believe something and how you justify it biblically. Shouldn't that be a prerequisite for an invitation at an Evangelical Christian school to the panel on which you want your voice heard? I don't expect us to agree on much, honestly, but students of Greek and Hebrew who eventually get MDivs and PhDs tend to take certain things for granted—because that's how reasonable discourse takes place. It seems like (and please forgive me if I'm wrong) like you have made up your mind as to the validity of your stance. But that’s not how logic works, and the only people I've seen in your corner regarding the matter are a dubious reverend and an organization which is hostile to Christians (though perhaps no more than some of us have been to them, at times). Why shouldn't Biola's perspective be biblically based? Because you have GLAAD calling for Dr. Thoennes' resignation? Or because Dr. Love thinks he's being mean and you think he's being racist. Wouldn't the standby arguments comparing homosexuality between consenting adults to pedophilia or bestiality be more offensive to you than racism? I don’t know on what grounds you hope or expect your demands of fairness and tolerance to be met.

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    2. Honestly, Dr. Thoennes probably just has better things to do than explain to people that Paul isn’t joking around about homosexuality. But the question I think you need to ask yourself (and God help me, Jos, I mean these questions as respectfully as I can muster) is why do you even seek/need a biblical defense of something you have already decided you’re on board with? Assuming you believe homosexuality is biblically acceptable, why go through the charade of twisting Scripture to fit your lifestyle? Assuming you don’t care if homosexuality is biblically acceptable, why go through the trouble of twisting Biola to fit your lifestyle?

      Finally, the gender issues you discuss are heart-rending and the struggles of gender identity (and I daresay confusion) that people have and continue to experience, sad chapters in a long, sad history of humanity's brokenness. I hope Biola will be sensitive and prayerful on that matter, but transgender restrooms are not something you should hold your breath for (but not because they're bigots at Biola—but because they're pragmatic and business-minded).

      Lastly, God bless you for your forbearance on my utter ignorance on much of the terminology and phrasing that I undoubtedly butchered to death at times. It has been so gracious of you to turn a blind eye to my obvious novice status on the way I talk about this and identify people whose identity is so important to them. Thanks so much for your ridiculous patience in all of this—I’m tearing up a little when I think of how insulted you could have been by me and you never said a word. My prayer is that the healing which is so desperately needed between the church and the GLBTQ community, will come from the Truth rather than our feelings. The following is an excerpt from a Lesbian's Letter to the Church (and the links that follow will take you to her letter, and an article explaining why it is being largely ignored by progressives):
      "To the churches concerning homosexuals and lesbians:
      Many of you believe that we do not exist within your walls, your schools, your neighborhoods. You believe that we are few and easily recognized. I tell you we are many. We are your teachers, doctors, accountants, high school athletes. We are all colors, shapes, sizes. We are single, married, mothers, fathers. We are your sons, your daughters, your nieces, your nephews, your grandchildren. We are in your Sunday School classes, pews, choirs, and pulpits. You choose not to see us out of ignorance or because it might upset your congregation. We ARE your congregation. We enter your doors weekly seeking guidance and some glimmer of hope that we can change. Like you, we have invited Jesus into our hearts. Like you, we want to be all that Christ wants us to be. Like you, we pray daily for guidance. Like you, we often fail......To those of you who would change the church to accept the gay community and its lifestyle: you give us no hope at all. To those of us who know God’s word and will not dilute it to fit our desires, we ask you to read John’s letter to the church in Pergamum. “I have a few things against you: You have people there who hold to the teaching of Balaam, who taught Balak to entice the Israelites to sin by eating food sacrificed to idols and by committing sexual immorality. Likewise, you also have those who hold to the teaching of the Nicolaitans. Repent therefore!” You are willing to compromise the word of God to be politically correct. We are not deceived. If we accept your willingness to compromise, then we must also compromise. We must therefore accept your lying, your adultery, your lust, your idolatry, your addictions, YOUR sins. 'He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.' "

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    3. Thanks again Jos, I don't want to make you feel like you need to continue this dialogue unless it’s been fruitful for you but it has been a huge blessing to me that among other things, you've given me the grace to misunderstand occasionally and get lost in my own verbosity. I foolishly tend to think that bravery, not brevity, is the soul of wit. Let’s pray for each other.

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